[00:00:12.200] – Speaker 2
Well, hey, I’m Chris Tompkins, and welcome to the Shaping Our World podcast. My goal is to invite you into a conversation that will leave you more confident in understanding and inspiring the young people in your life. Each episode, we talk with leading experts and offer relevant resources to dive deeper into the world of our youth Today, we have Jamie Lynn Tatera on the show. Jamie Lynn is an award-winning author, bilingual educator, and creator of the research-based Mindfulness and Self Compassion for Children and Caregivers programme. For more than a decade, she’s been making mindful self-compassion fun and accessible in classrooms across Milwaukee and around the globe, helping kids, teens, caregivers, and educators apply these skills to tough emotions like anger, self-criticism, and anxiety. Jamie Lynn trains teachers through her resiliency programmes, and her mindfulness and self-compassion workbook for kids has become a go-to resource for families looking to build emotional strength together. I’m really looking forward to this conversation because Jamie Lynn not only knows the research, she offers playful, practical ideas parents can start using right away. Whether you’re guiding a preschooler with big feelings or a teen wrestling with perfectionism, this episode is packed with approachable tools and hopeful insights.
[00:01:33.800] – Speaker 2
Now, let’s join in to the conversation with Jamie Lynn Tatera. Before we meet our guest, a quick word about an opportunity at Muskoka Woods. Starting as a staff member here, I found it to be more than just a job. I discovered a pathway to personal and professional growth. We are committed to intentional staff development, providing training, and building a network that can propel your career forward. Imagine working where you’re nurtured to grow with access to amazing facilities and staff care events. If you’re seeking a role that prepares you for what’s next, visit jobs.muskokawoods.com for more details. Now, let’s get into the heart of our show. Jamie Lynn, it’s great to have you. Thanks for coming on the show today.
[00:02:21.560] – Speaker 1
Thank you so much, Chris. Glad to be here.
[00:02:23.340] – Speaker 2
Yeah, I’m looking forward to this conversation. As we get going, I wanted to help our listeners get to know you a little bit better. What shaped your world when you were growing up? When you’re a child, a teenager, what were the biggest influences that shaped you?
[00:02:37.120] – Speaker 1
Wow. Okay. As a child, I lived… One of the neat things is I grew up with a forest in my backyard, so I I would definitely say nature shaped me as a child. I would just say my family shaped me as a child. We were a pretty close unit. I’d say those were my biggest influences as a child. As a teen, things I went off the rails somewhere in between being a child and a teenager. I wasn’t making the world’s best choices when I was a teenager. I’d say, well, my friends definitely influenced me. My dad did still. I lived with my dad at that time. I’d say whatever I needed to do to be popular probably shaped me as a teen. Yeah, definitely a gap between child and teen. Then around age 20, I made another shift. But there was different influences, different ages.
[00:03:34.140] – Speaker 2
Well, I’m sure most of our listeners probably can relate to that and maybe their own journey. If not, maybe they’re seeing it in their kid’s journey right now. I guess that’s part of the growing up curve for many of us. What’s shaping your role today? Help us get to know you outside of your professional life and your work, which we’re going to talk about in a minute. What are the things that you’re interested in now? What influences you today?
[00:03:56.580] – Speaker 1
Well, and that’s so funny because you say outside of my work because my My life and my work are so woven together. It’s definitely my values. I value social justice. I value well-being for myself in the world. That reflects in my work, but it also just reflects in my life in general. I really value kids well-being and parental well-being. I just think it permeates who I am, and I feel like I can’t completely separate it out from what I Well, that’s great.
[00:04:31.200] – Speaker 2
That value system definitely is part of your life and part of your work. Tell us a little bit about the work you’re doing and how that shapes the world of families and kids.
[00:04:41.140] – Speaker 1
Sure. I started off as an elementary school educator. I taught for seven years in Milwaukee Public Schools. Then I became a continuing education provider for educator in the field of mindfulness and yoga and self-compassion. That led, Once I had kids, it led to me realising kids need grownups who have well-being, but kids also need to be taught well-being. I had discovered, I had stumbled upon when I had my first daughter, I had stumbled upon something called mindful self-compassion, which taught me how to actually be kind to myself when I was struggling, which was, I don’t know, it was just a novel idea. I think I had thought before, again, teenage years, how do I numb myself when I’m struggling? Then stop doing the numbing activities. How do I fix myself when I’m struggling? But how do I be kind to myself when I’m struggling? That was a really profound idea. There was this whole training programme that I took as an adult in learning the art of being kind to myself during my challenges. Once I learned it, I thought, Oh, no, we need kids to get this from the little on. I developed… There’s a researcher, her name is Kristin Neff.
[00:06:00.620] – Speaker 1
She’s a researcher, she’s also a programme creator of Mindful Self Compassion. I created an adaptation for parents and kids of her work. Then from there, flowed out into other manifestations of how do we help kids grow the resources of mindfulness and self-kindness.
[00:06:20.120] – Speaker 2
That’s what really drew us to have you on the show is this work that you’ve done. And thinking about this topic in general, and just even listening to you unpack that there, this idea of being kind to ourselves, which as a parent myself and someone who’s around kids a lot, is something that I think we often hear a lot is this self-critical kid. Our language often puts ourselves down. You hear it in adults, but when you hear it in kids, it’s a bit more profound. We wanted to start off the conversation before we dive into the specifics of your work and ideas of self-compassion, to even start to talk to families, to give them a little bit of insight, encouragement, advice to parents who are maybe overwhelmed or unsure of how to support their self-critical child, the kid that’s always putting themselves down. What would you say, even before we get into the specifics of your work?
[00:07:21.160] – Speaker 1
Self-criticism is a challenge. It’s complex. I’d say the first thing for parents to get curious about is, are you also self self-critical. It’s not always. Sometimes we have kids that are self-critical and parents that are not. But it’s not uncommon for a kid that’s very self-critical to have a parent that is also has almost impossible standards for themselves. I will say this, too. There’s different manifestations of being self-critical. But one way that one could define it is, one, expecting perfection of themselves, and then being derating themselves if they don’t reach it. The other has a lot to do with tone of voice. Let’s just say I try to do something and I fail. To notice that I failed and say, Wow, I need to improve, that actually can be a form of self-kindness. But to say to yourself, You know what? You failed. There’s something in a tone. There might be other words that accompany it, like what’s wrong with you? You’re such a failure. Or it just might be an attitude, a tone of disrespect. I think when I want to talk about self-criticalness, I want to talk about it not just in words, but also in that tone and in this idea of impossible expectations.
[00:08:43.240] – Speaker 2
Yeah, that’s really helpful. I think you’re right. It’s what you say and how you say it. How you say it. That’s so good. Yeah, can you share some insight on that?
[00:08:53.750] – Speaker 1
Yes. If a parent is a one, I’d be curious if the parent is like, Oh, wow, I do actually. I am really quite hard on myself as well and/or have impossible standards. I would encourage you to learn self-compassion as a parent. Start with yourself first because it’s hard to help a child develop a skill that you have not yet acquired. Truthfully, learning to be kind to yourself, you can train yourself this, which is beautiful. It’s a learnable skill. Learning to accept human imperfection while still having high standards. This is a learnable skill. Learning to give yourself comfort when you fall short because it’s hard. This is a learnable skill. That’s the first thing I’d say is adult caregiver start to learn how to respond to struggle with kindness and then how to respond with the kids. So this is so tricky and nuanced. It’s interesting, too, because I have two daughters, and one is almost 17, one is 12. Both of them can be self-critical, but one was just born more self-critical the other. I’m not saying it’s a parents’ fault if a child is self-critical. Sometimes a kid is just wired in a way where they’re hard on themselves.
[00:10:08.740] – Speaker 1
I think those kids oftentimes have a little bit more activation in their amygdala and their fear response, and so they might have bigger emotions in general. What we actually want to learn to do is, outside of those critical moments, teach them the skills of mindfulness and self-compassion. Then when they’re being self-critical, actually learning how as a caregiver, to hold it in a mindful and kind awareness. I’m going to give an example of this. I’ll share what’s helpful and not helpful. This is actually my almost 17-year-old. She went through a period this year where she was being more self-critical. She goes to a high school. There’s a lot of high-performing kids. She took an AP music theory, but other than that, she’s in regular classes. She was being hard on herself because her friend group has all these advanced placement classes and double advanced in math She was being hard on herself. At first, I was doing the thing that parents oftentimes do. I was like, Maya, don’t compare yourself to others. You’re a really good person. I was like, You need to be kind to yourself. Use your capacity. I was doing the things that we do, which is I was resisting her self-critical voice.
[00:11:20.500] – Speaker 1
The truth is what we resist persists. Her self-critical voice was kicking back. It was upping its game because I was resisting it. What was actually really helpful to her It was at some point, I just softened in myself and I said, Wow, it must be really hard to have such a self-critical voice driving you. This must be really challenging. That was the opening. It’s learning as a caregiver to be able to actually meet, and this transcends self-criticism, to be able to meet whatever internal trouble is going on with our child with mindful awareness, empathy, and kindness.
[00:11:59.280] – Speaker 2
I wonder I’m thinking about this as you’re talking. Do you think for kids there are areas of their lives where they might tend to be more self-critical? I’m sure it’s different for every kid in general, because I think of I have a friend who he is so critical of himself when he golfs. Like, literally, when we’re out there, the second we get on the course, it starts. This is the worst game. I can’t play. I can’t hit this club. This is a horrible hole. And that for him, that’s an area where maybe that shows up. Do you think for kids, there are maybe some areas where this might show up more than other places?
[00:12:37.420] – Speaker 1
Well, absolutely. I mean, any area where you think you’re comparatively less effective, self-criticism is more likely to show up. I will say this, too. People don’t realise this. Sometimes people are like, well, because the truth is self-criticism and shame are really linked. So it’s perfectionism. There’s a researcher named Brené Brown. I’ve read a lot of her work, and she says perfectionism is a shame shield. Shame is really a fear that we’re going to not belong, we’re going to not be loved. And again, this might manifest by thinking, Oh, I’m not… People are not going to think I’m good enough at this. Again, oftentimes the deeper levels of I’m afraid that I’m unlovable, I’m afraid I won’t belong, are not visible on the surface. They don’t know, they don’t want to be not good enough. Some people, again, have this more pervasive divisively, where they have just a big fear of not performing on level because what does this mean about my value as a human? Other people might have more of a solid foundation, and so it might just show up in random places, and it’s not as much of a… I mean, they talk about there’s trait shame and there’s state shame.
[00:13:51.020] – Speaker 1
If it’s trait shame, it’s been internalised to a point where it’s probably going to pop up in a lot of areas. If it’s state shame, maybe it just comes up on the golf course because this This is an area where you embarrassed early on, and every time you get back on the course, you think, Oh, no, not this again.
[00:14:04.620] – Speaker 2
There’s been some guests on the show as we’ve talked, where we really focused in on the rising expectations of kids today. You mentioned your daughter and the type of classes she takes, the competitiveness to get into the right school and to build the resume early. Do you feel that that’s changing a little bit over time? It’s getting harder and harder for these kids to measure up, or is that just a product of the world we live in and It’s like that for us in different ways.
[00:14:31.760] – Speaker 1
No, I think that’s it. At least from my own lived experience, that’s a change of thing. For myself, when I was in high school, I always took a study hall. And back then, they did not have… You couldn’t get above a 4. 0. I remember thinking like, Why would I take more advanced classes to get the same 4. 0? That’s changed now. Now you can get above a 4. 0. I think, too, the competitive sports, the clubs, I really do think there is a shift in helping kids be way above average as if that’s the norm that wasn’t there years ago. I think there has been a shift.
[00:15:12.400] – Speaker 2
I would imagine, too, the rise of social media and comparison through that affects not just kids, but adults as well, because now we can be harder on ourselves because there’s this, and we know this, mostly sometimes curated world out there that we’re comparing ourselves to trying to measure up to. So the expectations are changing, and so is the world in which we evaluate those expectations. I’m sure that all feeds into this pressure kids feel and why they may be more inclined than before in that self-criticalness that we’ve started to talk about.
[00:15:48.700] – Speaker 1
Yeah, definitely could be. I’m a big fan of teaching kids early on to be critical of… Even to teach them how you can even start off early with kids that are on YouTube. How do you shape your feed? How What does your feed make you feel? And helping kids to be mindful, to be aware of the impact of what’s coming in, and teaching them to have agency to know that they can shape it. I’m a big fan of conscious social media use.
[00:16:15.500] – Speaker 2
Let’s dive into your programme. You created the Mindfulness and Self Compassion for Children and Caregivers programme, which helps families apply some of the things we’ve been talking about to challenging emotions. Can you tell us a little bit about the impetus of this programme, how it got going, before we dive into all that it’s about?
[00:16:34.980] – Speaker 1
Absolutely. Well, and again, as I shared earlier, I took the adult programme and I thought, Oh, my gosh, this is wonderful. Then I trained to teach the teen programme of Mindful Self Compassion, and I thought, This is great. Then I thought, How do you develop it for younger kids? I will share this, too. I’ve also published a series of workbooks. Workbook 1 was published in October of 2024, and actually, workbook 2 is coming out in January of 2026. The way I learned to teach was by trial and error. I knew the concepts I wanted to teach, and I am an educator by trade, but I experimented to see what lands with kids. The programme really has evolved over time. The overarching goal of the programme is to teach what we call the three components of mindful self-compassion, which is mindful awareness, meaning kindness we can give at any moment. Compassion is kindness in the presence of struggle or kindness in the presence of suffering. The mindful awareness part of mindful self-compassion is, can I be aware when I’m having a moment of struggle? Which means I don’t minimise it, and I also don’t go flying off the handle with a story.
[00:17:51.520] – Speaker 1
Being able to hold an air awareness, I’m having a hard time. Then the second component is a sense of connexion to the greater humanity. With self-criticism, when I’m struggling, I think, What’s wrong with me? Why am I falling short? I’m so whatever. There’s a lot of self-blame. With self-compassion, I think I’m struggling. It is human to struggle. We all have difficult moments sometimes. So there’s what we call sometimes common humanity. Then the third component is self-kindness. Giving ourselves what we need during the moments of struggle, or sometimes we like to say treating ourselves like we treat a good friend when things go wrong. The programme is designed to teach those three different things and teach mindful awareness, a sense of connexion, and also kindness to self and others. You can’t completely separate out the two. We do it in a really playful way. I like to teach the course optimally to parent-child pairs, although it can be taught to groups of children only, and I also teach it in schools. We use animals to teach all of it. It’s It’s play-based to a degree, and kids do exercises that are engaging, and then the animals teach the different practises.
[00:19:10.380] – Speaker 2
That’s clever.
[00:19:11.760] – Speaker 1
Yeah. Again, this was created by kids. Kids helped me realise what engages and what doesn’t engage, and then I modified accordingly.
[00:19:19.640] – Speaker 2
Do you have an example you could share with us about an activity or a practical component of this? Well, why don’t I?
[00:19:26.600] – Speaker 1
This isn’t necessarily an animal one, but I feel like this is a good starter activity for parents, and it unlocks the rest. We cannot be kind to ourselves during our moments of struggle if we can’t even be aware that we’re having struggle. I’ll share this, too. This is a little fun note. I got actually on my website, jamielyneterra. Com, I’ve got this, I call it a feelings animal quiz, where you can find out, what is your habit with feelings? Do you hide feelings, like a chameleon? Do you explode with feelings, like a bear? Or are they just big inside of you? Are you a big feelings person? Do you obsess about your feelings like the beaver? Or are you like the deer where you feel ashamed, I shouldn’t feel like this? First, I like to help kids to become aware of what is their feelings habit. You’d be surprised at… Again, there’s a real diversity among kids around whether they are feelings-hider, big feelings kids. Again, oftentimes kids and grownups, by the way, grownups can take this quiz, too. Oftentimes, we share habits across a couple of animals. One, I’d say that’s a great thing for parents to do.
[00:20:33.220] – Speaker 1
Take the quiz with your kids and start talking about your habits and non-stigmatizing them. If you have no idea how you feel, well, you have the chameleon habit. Time to start getting curious. If you are always exploding, can you be kind to yourself? Because it’s hard to have such big feelings. I like to start by helping people become aware of what’s already happening. Then once we’ve got a little base where able to say, Okay, this is how I typically respond to feelings, where kids really understand. I think inside out, if parents have not watched the movies, the series of movies, watch them with your kids. Because there’s so much great science in there. But one of the One of the things that the protagonist of that movie learns towards the end of the first movie is that you can have more than one feeling at a time. This can be so liberating with kids. In my workbook, I do this with foods, but when I’m in a classroom, I’ll oftentimes do this with crayons. We use different crayons to represent different feelings. Maybe red is anger, blue is sadness. Again, you don’t have to do these colours.
[00:21:42.460] – Speaker 1
We start to talk about all the different feelings a person could have in a given situation. Let’s say you really want a particular toy. You go to your friend’s birthday party and they get that toy. What are you going to feel? Then I actually get a little plate, and I have kids put the crayons on their plate of like, Oh, I might feel mad. I might feel jealous. I might feel maybe a teeny bit happy or hopeful that they’ll share the toy with me. We start to talk about how the fact is you can allow space for all of this. Challenging emotions do not mean that you’re a bad person, something is wrong. It means you’re human. That’s a fun exercise that I like to start off with with groups, is we call it the share the plate exercise, where you really learn to just simply allow different emotions to exist. Then if you wanted to take it one step further, you could take the crans. Actually, I do this in the first session of my parent-child class. We talk about feelings about taking a parent-child self-compassion class. Some kids are like, I’m angry. It’s a fun class, but it’s not playing a video game.
[00:22:54.060] – Speaker 1
We just create space. Yeah, you’re angry. You’d rather be playing. What else? We just create space, create space. Then we take a a little washcloth and we wrap the difficult emotions in compassion. Those crayons that are like, disappointment, sadness, anger, we wrap them and just say, Well, this is really hard. This is human. I understand. And then the positive emotions, eventually, we don’t get to this till like, session six, but we learn to treat them like cookies on a plate. We smell them when we try to enjoy them. Because ultimately, we want kids to savour positive emotions in neat, challenging emotions with mindful awareness and compassion.
[00:23:30.000] – Speaker 2
So good. As I’m listening to that, I’m like, I could probably do with that course myself.
[00:23:35.440] – Speaker 1
I think a lot of us can. Absolutely.
[00:23:39.020] – Speaker 2
Just thinking of wrapping some of my emotions as they’re there and like cookies. It’s great. You mentioned something when you were breaking down the three components of self-compassion that piqued some interest to me. When you were talking about self-kindness, you talked about the question, what do I need? I know there’s going to be a tonne of different answers for this. As we’re learning to identify through mindfulness, self-compassion, what these feelings are, what we’re going through, the emotions. Then if we ask that question, what are some typical responses that you… What do we need when we’re feeling overwhelmed or scared or angry? Again, I know it’s so broad, but I wonder if you can help us.
[00:24:21.540] – Speaker 1
I love the question, and I do actually have a pretty solid answer. Amazing. I told you, my workbook series has… There’s two workbooks. In the first In the first workbook, we do the feelings quiz, what’s your feelings habits? In the second workbook, we do the Resilience Animal quiz, which is… Basically, it’s like, When things go wrong, what do I need? There’s five animals that I use to teach resilience habits. So spots the Laff teaches us mindful awareness. Buddy the dog teaches us we’re not alone. Snuggles, which I’m going to go back to. I’m going to end on this one. But Snuggles teaches us to be kind to ourself when things go wrong. Sunny helps us to notice good things. And Doodle the Dolphin helps us to take action. So truthfully, sometimes when I’m struggling, I need to focus more on feelings. Sometimes when I’m struggling, I’m being sticky for feelings, and I need to go for a walk. I need to take a break from feelings. I need to read in the book. So not always is it leaning in. Sometimes I need to lean out to get some perspective so I’m not overwhelmed so then I can re-approach my feelings in a more balanced way.
[00:25:27.660] – Speaker 1
But I wanted to end the question with my animal that we call Snuggles the Bunny, which is the kindness animal. Snuggles the Bunny also has a cape, which can be super Snuggles. I like to explain. I actually have a really fun video on my YouTube channel where Is it one animal or is it two? Anyways, I won’t go into it. But it’s a playful little one-minute video that comes out at the end that it’s the same. It’s all kindness as kindness, whether it’s gentle or strong. But sometimes when we’re struggling, We really need gentle kindness. We need to hear, Wow, that’s hard. I’m here for you. You’re not alone. Sometimes we need strong kindness. We need to hear, You can do hard things. You’ve got this. This is going to pass. You’re going to be okay. The truth is, if you think about this, if you get the wrong one at the wrong time, it’s like two thumbs down. If I call a friend and I need comfort and they’re like, You’re going to be okay, I really don’t like that because I just want you to tell me this is hard. If I really am looking for encouragement, you’re like, Oh, this is so hard, I don’t like that because what I really want to hear is that I can handle this.
[00:26:41.680] – Speaker 1
So part of asking ourselves what we need, and ultimately, by the way, we need both, but we need different doses at different times, is do I need gentle comfort or do I need strong support? And that’s a big piece of it as well.
[00:26:57.080] – Speaker 2
And you can correct me if I’m wrong, I think sometimes just asking the question is almost more important than the answer sometimes because you’ll move towards something. I think sometimes I get paralysed with like, Oh, is that actually what I need? Or am I moving in the right direction?
[00:27:11.160] – Speaker 1
Absolutely, 100%. And it’s funny because I have this collection of animals that are on my desk next to me. Then there’s one extra one that’s my Curious Chick. Just being curious, it’s called Curie, the Curious Chick. Just being curious is its own kindness. It’s oftentimes the best place to start. Maybe you don’t know how you feel, maybe you don’t know what need. But just getting curious is absolutely its own kindness.
[00:27:34.480] – Speaker 2
There’s so much kids today, well, all of us, but we’re talking mostly about kids and young people today. There’s so many things they have to navigate in life. We’ve heard a lot about recent statistics on anxiety and different things like that. How does practising mindfulness and self-compassion really help young people and kids? Why should we go through all the effort to do this? What’s the outcome?
[00:27:58.900] – Speaker 1
Yeah, absolutely great Good question. The research on kids, as far as I know, it begins with my programme. We’re just wrapping up a second research study on my parent-child self-compassion programme. We’ve seen decreases in depression for children The last one was specifically focused on anxiety, and we saw a 6% average decrease in anxiety. That’s a really good thing. Anecdotally, there was lots of good comments from parents and kids. That’s the studies on the intervention itself for kids, that’s what we’ve got right now. A lot of the research has also been done on teens, again, showing increases in resilience for teens that have even suicidal ideation. They’ve done some studies on kids that are transgender. They’ve shown decreases in suicidal ideation, even six months out, increases in resilience, increases in well-being. A lot of diminishment of psychological challenges and enhancements of well-being. Then the research on adults is like, I can’t tell you how many thousands of studies there’s been on adults that just show very, very clearly that people that are able to be kind and supportive to themselves during their difficult moments bounce back better from challenges, have better relationships. I mean, it’s intuitive, but it’s nice to know the research because sometimes people are afraid, Wait a second.
[00:29:22.380] – Speaker 1
If I’m kind to myself when I’m struggling, I’m not going to work hard enough or I’m not going to be motivated to perform. To know the research that, No, no, no. You will be motivated to perform, but not because you’re afraid you’re a failure if you miss the mark, but because you know what your values are and you can encourage yourself with kindness. The research can help people to take that, quote, unquote, leap of faith to shift the locus of what they’re using to motivate. So it being self-kindness and care rather than fear of not measuring up.
[00:29:54.660] – Speaker 2
On your website, there’s a great quote that says, Self-compassion is not so much a technique as it is a way of being. We had another guest on our show a little while back that was speaking about similar topics, and she compared building self-compassion to building a muscle. And so you shared a lot with us. Can you tell us, where do we start? Is there a tip or a trick to help build this into a way of being?
[00:30:21.840] – Speaker 1
Absolutely. Well, an accessible, I guess, I don’t know if I call it trick or tip, but an accessible way to access the mindset for an adult is oftentimes, what would I say to a friend if they were in this situation? Once you’ve accessed, Oh, I’d say this, be like, Okay, can I just try saying it to myself? Even if it’s a little awkward at first, guess what? But your internal voice is oftentimes trained by your environment. For you to learn to train your own internal voice is not inauthentic, it’s agentic. It’s like being the hammer, not the nail. That’s a good one. It can sometimes be harder for kids to use that access point because kids are oftentimes, and some of us as adults, we don’t know what to say to our friends when things go wrong. There’s a lot of kids that are like, I don’t know what to do when my friend’s upset, distract them. It’s oftentimes building for children. It’s building empathy and kindness for others. At the same time, we’re building empathy and kindness for self. If the kids have that for others, then they can turn it around and build it for themselves.
[00:31:27.680] – Speaker 1
If they don’t yet, then They might actually build their own foundation of self-kindness and let that be a resource for, Okay, here’s how I want to treat others. Truthfully, oftentimes, kids will get self-compassional a lot by from how their caregivers treat them. A lot of the internalisation can happen from their environments.
[00:31:48.020] – Speaker 2
I think a lot of that starts with, as you’ve talked about, mindfulness and being present and being aware. I loved your… Was it the Chick that was named Curious?
[00:31:59.260] – Speaker 1
Yeah, the I have a check named Curie, yes.
[00:32:01.220] – Speaker 2
Curie. I love that. Is there anything we can do? Because I know sometimes when anxiety wells up in us, it’s hard to even be conscious of where you are and be present and be mindful. Are there Are there any things that we can help our kids do in moments of anxiety to just be present and centred and realise what’s happening inside of them?
[00:32:24.740] – Speaker 1
All right, I’m going to pause that question because I just want to back up for a moment. Instead of parents, one of the most important things is that your kids know that you’re on the learning team with them. A lot of times parents want to model having it all together. You don’t do your child’s service when you do because your child thinks, Oh, my gosh, my parent has it all together and I’m all messed up and what am I doing wrong? Instead, modelling is super important. Modelling, I’m having a difficult moment. Modelling, here’s the resource I’m using. Modelling. I was being critical to myself in my head, and then I reminded myself, You know what? Everybody makes mistakes sometimes. Really, I just want to emphasise to parents, you can co-lear this with your child. Actually being a learner and being a human alongside your child is one of the best ways that you can help them to learn self-compassion. Then as far as your actual question was, how do I help my child or myself in that moment of anxiety? What I’d like to say is, don’t build skills during your moments of anxiety, because the prefrontal cortex tends to go offline, the thinking part of our brain when we’re anxious.
[00:33:32.620] – Speaker 1
It’s really important to build these skills when you and your child are feeling okay, actually proactively, to build it into a habit so that now it’s accessible. Then when your child is having those moments of struggles, you can externally be the voice of mindful awareness while you’re having a hard time, your anxiety is really kicking up, this is hard, everyone gets anxious sometimes, we’re going to get through this. You can be those external things. Then you have to know your child enough to know what’s going to be helpful. Is it going to be helpful to dig in a little bit more? Or is it going to be helpful after you’ve validated your child’s anxiety, help them know they’re not alone and help them have a sense of kindness? Is it actually going to be more helpful to play a game of iSpy? We’re going to shift things now, get out of this feelings part of our brain and into our mindful awareness part of our brain, because otherwise you’re going to start spinning. That’s really It’s important to have a relationship with your child so you can sense what they need. Then the last thing I’ll share on that is give yourself compassion.
[00:34:37.560] – Speaker 1
Like, build your own resource because it is so hard to just stay present and calm when your child is spiralling. But that’s truthfully one of the best things you can do is give yourself kindness. Say, This is really hard. This isn’t my fault. How can I soothe myself so that at least I don’t fall into the spiral of anxiety with my child?
[00:34:58.040] – Speaker 2
Just I’m intrigued by, as you mentioned earlier, you started… Well, part of your journey has been to be a yoga instructor, and you specialised training in therapeutic benefits of yoga for children. I love this idea that there’s this physical connexion to the practise of mindfulness. What’s the impact of yoga when it comes to self-compassion and mindfulness for both kids and adults? Are there other physical activities that aid in this?
[00:35:26.880] – Speaker 1
Yes, absolutely. Again, that was my entry point. I started with the body because it’s really hard to be mindful. Adults oftentimes practise mindfulness while still, and I’m like, Good luck. I mean, maybe if you have a really quiet brain, but if your brain is like my brain, good luck. It’s much easier to become aware of body sensations as your body is moving through space. That could be yoga. That could be any a movement where you’re invited to notice sensations in the body. I think that that is definitely more of an accessible pathway for kids to build mindful body awareness than stillness. I think that’s harder for most kids, and I think actually it’s actually hard for a lot of grownups, too. To note, too, that the body is the place where we store the sensations that correspond with emotions. If we’re anxious, oftentimes we also have anxious bodies, and it can be a loop of whether what’s the real… Is the body anxiety triggering the mind? Is the mind anxiety triggering the body? It’s a feedback loop. But learning how to take those deep breaths, move and stretch your body, or even run around the block will release some of those physiological symptoms, which will in turn calm the mind.
[00:36:43.600] – Speaker 2
This conversation has been so helpful, and we’ve moved through it at a rapid pace. I’m like, there’s so much gold that you’re bringing to this. And as we wrap up our time, obviously, we’re going to suggest people to go to take a look at your website, which You mentioned earlier, jamielyneterra. Com. And there’s your programme. There’s other resources there for parents. Can you maybe highlight a few of them that you would love to suggest to parents around this topic? And then any other resources around mindfulness and self-compassion that you might suggest to parents who are like, This has been so fascinating. How do I learn more?
[00:37:22.740] – Speaker 1
Absolutely. Well, again, for kids, I think the mindfulness and self-compassion workbooks for kids that I wrote are definitely the most accessible entry point. As far as adult learning, I offer adult classes, but I would go to… Kristin Neff has a website, selfcompassion.org. That is a phenomenal resource. She also co-published a workbook with Chris Germer called The Mindful Self Compassion Workbook. That is a great resource. Then there’s some parenting books that are super helpful. Like Daniel Siegel and Tina Payne-Brison wrote The Whole-Brain Child. Great for learning to realise what’s going on with your kids, what are helpful strategies. Becky Kennedy She wrote the book Good Inside. Phenomenal. I don’t even think she calls it self-compassion ever, but she’s talking about self-compassion. This idea of how do you help your kid know that they’re good inside, and how do you help yourself as a parent know that you’re good inside, even when you’re struggling with external behaviour. And so all of those are awesome resources. Becky Kennedy has a podcast, too, Good Insight. So they’re great resources for just learning to build your own self-kindness toolkit and learning how to help your child be able to self-regulate as well.
[00:38:32.000] – Speaker 2
And we’ll make sure people get access to the things that you mentioned and link to that. As we wrap up, Jamie Lynn, I wonder if… Yeah, just maybe a final piece of encouragement or a thought to parents who are just like, This has been so good, but I just feel like I’m trying so hard and there’s so much, and I really want to help my kids, and I feel like I’m not getting any traction. Maybe just a word of encouragement as we wrap up our conversation today.
[00:39:01.740] – Speaker 1
Right. Well, it’s twofold. It’s one, you’re doing great. You’re here listening to a podcast. You care so much about your kid. Soak in that goodness. Two, remember that imperfection is a part of life. This is the common humanity. If your kids are imperfect and you are an imperfect parent, this is not a mistake. This is a beautiful part of the human condition. What’s it like maybe to put down a little bit of striving and just love yourself and child as imperfect humans? Because oftentimes that’s really where the gold is.
[00:39:36.120] – Speaker 2
Thank you so much for all the work you’re doing and helping families and for the conversation today. Really insightful. I’ve been scribbling notes down beside as we’ve been going, and I’m sure so many of our listeners have as well. So thank you for your time today, Jamie Lynn.
[00:39:49.520] – Speaker 1
Awesome. Thanks, Chris, for having me.
[00:39:55.100] – Speaker 2
Well, that’s it for today’s episode. If you found Jamie Lynn Tatera’s insights on mindful self-compassion and practical strategies for supporting kids helpful. And want to explore more conversations like this, visit muskokawoods.com. There you’ll find a blog post for every episode of Shaping Our World, packed with highlights, key takeaways, and a link to listen again. While you’re there, explore how Muskoka Woods is creating life-changing experiences that help young people grow in confidence, character, and connexion. Don’t forget to subscribe and share this episode with someone you think needs to hear it.
